fanlore | Opinions wanted!

Opinions wanted!

Edited to add, January 11, 2010: I did some tweaking to the usage section of the page. I tied the dictionary cite into the part about aca usage, so that it now clearly says that the fan fiction usage is correct in academia and American publishing. I shamelessly borrowed some phrasing from this conversation. I found some cites, but there is no cite for the idea that the fan fiction usage denotes aca or noob anywhere other than here, and the talk page itself. Anyone got one?

Go check it out and edit that page or something else while you're there--if the urge hits, that is.

------------------------------

As I found out on the OTW news site, fan fiction has hit the dictionary. There is a discussion on the Fan Fiction page from a while back about usage on the page itself, and about what that usage says about the person using the, er, usage.

We could really use (had to, sorry) some fresh opinions, and even some cites on this.

Should the Fan Fiction page use the term fanfiction, or fan fiction? Does writing it as fan fiction make people think you're a noob or even an acafan in disguise? Should I have made this a poll?

Opinions here, or on the talk page at Fanlore would be appreciated.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

Close to 100% of my readings lists on DW and LJ use "fanfiction" or "fanfic" or just "fic". Having read the post on the OTW blog, I can't disagree with the TWC' editors reasoning, and if and when I ever write something about fandom for a non-fannish audience, I'll probably use "fan fiction" as per the dictionary spelling. But even as an academic in training, writing it out with two words just seems...odd to me. I think, for myself personally and within fandom, I don't personally feel a need to emphasize fan agency that way; it seems redundant.

I'm really not a fan of "fan fiction". Maybe it has to do with my native language, where compounds are written as one, or maybe it's the fact that I've only ever seen "fan fiction" when it was n00bs or people who wanted to seem professional. *shrug*

I also don't see why there has to be an emphasis on "fan".

Hee--I think its great to note that "fan fiction" is the "accepted, 'correct'" usage while noting that many fans have never striven to be either accepted or correct! *g* I personally say fanfiction, but then again, I don't have to be consistent--I wouldn't say fanvid or fanart, for instance, though I would say fanworks.

(Hm. Actually I went and looked and--I seem to say fiction, fanfic, or fic rather than either fanfiction or fan fiction! My page is called Speranza's Fiction, which--uh, surprised me. And when I looked at my last year's year in review, I had categories for fiction and vids, and I referred to fanfic. So who knows!)

Huh. I say fanart and fanvids too. Fan art and fan vids sound like they could just be art or vids made by fans (like a picture I drew of a tree, say)

Ah, but is it a fannish tree? *g* (I ask this coming from SGA, where hey, John Sheppard could be a tree... In fact, there's a J.Flan acting joke in there somewhere. *G*)

I've seen all of these usages--I'm just saying, I think most people don't care if they're consistent (I don't!) in the way editors typically have to. (More annoying, the editor of a multiple essay collection has to make each writer use the same word, otherwise it looks like one of them made a typo.

YES, it makes no real sense--as Andrew Jackson said, "It's a damn poor mind that can think of only one way to spell a word!"--but there you go.

Heh. No, I do not mean making a picture/vid about John Sheppard as a tree, just a regular non-fandom related tree.

And I didn't mean to say your usage was wrong, or that you were saying mine was. I just found it interesting that they're different :)

OMG. I totally forgot about this. Oh, SGA, you are hyperbole-defeating! Nothing can be as strange as you just naturally were!

It's certainly a remarkably varied fandom, I don't even like SGA much and yet while I was pondering a panel every time I tried to think of an example for a different weird type of meta vid the first one that came to mind was from SGA :)

I really like the idea of noting that fans have never striven to be accepted, correct or homogeneous in the fan fiction page itself. It reads like an either or right now, and I know I use both depending on the whim of my fingers on the keys.

Yeah, and even OTW and TWC have different practices--and why not?

Note: I use the spelling "fanfiction" and it's what I'm used to.

"Fan fiction" does register more formally. If in fact "fan fiction" is common enough among fans already it might be prudent to choose it. If that's not the case and "fanfiction" is what the majority of fans themselves use (this is from what I can tell true), I don't think the fact that "fan fiction" is "dictionary and academia approved" is a good enough reason to encourage a change in spelling. I also can't imagine those reasons going over well with fandom at large at all.

I don't know if anyone else has experienced this, but "fan fiction" trips my eyes up. I'm used to using it, but in general "fanfiction" I think is more instantly identifiable when reading quickly.

Edited 2010-01-11 02:42 (UTC)

"fan fiction" trips my eyes up. I'm used to using it, but in general "fanfiction" I think is more instantly identifiable when reading quickly.

Co-signed. I usually use fanfic or fanfiction myself, but I've never actually noticed whether the bulk oof my flist uses one or the other.

I have never noticed any difference in use between fan fiction and fanfiction. Fan fiction seems to be grammatically better.

I spend most of my time wincing every time someone writes 'a fic' but that battle was lost long, long ago.

I spend most of my time wincing every time someone writes 'a fic'

Oh god yes. I will turn cartwheels in order to avoid that usage, and generally say "story" at that point.

I would tend to argue that Fanlore's purpose is Orthogonal to MW's: or rather, both strive to be descriptive rather than prescriptive, but we're describing different groups of people.

I think there's no way to win on this one, they're all used and they're all right.

Hm. Interesting question. To be honest, I don't tend to process the difference too much; they all register as the same thing in my mind. Personally, I use fan fiction as a tag and on my archives, but mostly just use fic to describe what I'm writing (the occasional fan fic has slid in, now that I'm looking). I also consider fanvids to be one word, but fan art to be two. I'm not sure why.

I've always expected to see it as a compound, though just 'fic' tends to be my term of choice (but that's when I'm talking to other fans/people who know that the fan- is implied). To be honest, I didn't really get the reasoning why 'fan fiction' is more respectful of us or whatever (though I'm happy to nod my hat to the reasoning of convention. And the OED, which as a non-US fan I choose as my compass ;) ); to me fanfic is a process in and of itself, with a completely different expected beginning and endpoint to what 'fiction done by fans' implies. But that isn't really here nor there - personally I'd use 'fanfiction' unless enough people want it differently.

I find "fan fiction" looks weird. I use "fanfic" or just "fic", rarely "fanfiction". Official rules or not, in my experiencethe most common fannish spelling for an audience within fandom is not "fan fiction". I normally use "fanart" too not "fan art"

Speaking of fanart, the fanart article title on Fanlore is spelled as one word, so why not be consistent?

On the talk page I argued there in the last round of this discussion over a year ago in favor of moving "fan fiction" to "fanfiction", so I'd certainly be happy if the redirect went the other way around.

According to Merriam-Webster Online, the correct spelling uses two words.

fan fiction

Let's see. Is fan modifying fiction or is it a compound noun? Other genres are described as science fiction or romance fiction. But mysteries aren't generally called mystery fiction. OTOH, it's romance novel, science fiction novel, mystery novel. OTOH, fans can write their stories in any genre.

I come down on the side of one word, but that's just me. vamysteryfan

So, who's the audience for Fanlore? Is it us? Or is it outsiders? I think that should determine which form we use. (I note that it's Fanlore, not Fan Lore.)

I also don't see any reason to privilege the Merriam-Webster over the equally reputable AHD and other dictionaries which did not wait until 2009 to add fanfiction as a term.

I don't want to slam whoever wrote this, because I really appreciate all the hard work people have put in to Fanlore. However:
While fan fiction is the accepted, "correct" spelling of the term
I find that phrasing unfortunate. Accepted and "correct" according to whom? People other than those who write and read fanfic have the authority to choose what the correct term is? Really? That sentence could easily read "While fan fiction is the accepted spelling of the term used in academia and fan studies ..." and be way less insulting.

I like polls.

I like your change to that sentence, since it gets closer to the idea that MW is the defacto source for American publishing, not the whole of the world. I'm going to work on that page today if all goes well.

I like all the different changes to the page.

This has all been very interesting to watch.

Thank you, and yes, for many reasons having nothing to do with the actual project, it has been very interesting.

I did what I always do when it's down to one of these "this word or that word" questions.

Googlefight. :D

More sites apparently use the term "fanfiction". I would suggest doing something similar to wikipedia and reference both (and other) terms in the first line, which improves searchability, I reckon. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fan_fiction

I feel very strongly in favor of using "fanfiction" as a single word. I feel that this raises the question of who defines our identity; either fandom defines its identity for itself, or fandom allows external "authorities" to define it for us. I was under the impression that Fanlore and OTW were spaces where fandom defines itself, and that includes recording and defining (and spelling) our own terms.

Fandom tends to use "fanfic" as one word. Let's let fandom define itself and go with that.

THIS.

I have been using fan fiction, fanfiction and fan-fiction (somewhat) interchangeably since the early seventies. I prefer different forms for different usages, though I have no linguistic reasoning to back up any of my choices. It's just the way I have always done it.

I am a fan-fiction fan.
Fans of fan-fiction are very perceptive people.
I like the hyphenated form when the word fan is a used in the same sentence.

I use fanfiction when I'm talking about the fiction works of fandom as a whole, and fan fiction when I'm talking about what I write. I'd never thought about this until I read your post. Shows how clueless I've been about my own fannish vocabulary.

.
There is a difference between the pronunciation of "fan fiction" and "fanfiction" (at least in my mouth). I say - and most of the fans I've talked to in person say - "fanfiction".

But I'm well aware that the world doesn't adjust itself to suit me. "Fan fiction" looks slightly awkward to me, but I don't automatically think of aca or noob. (That question makes me go, "Huh?" It would never have occurred to me.)
.

I use fanfic or fanfiction, because it's a new word, it's easier to type, and it's somehow more distinct from the individual meanings of 'fan' and 'fiction'. Fanfiction is more than just fan fiction, fiction by fans. I dunno what more it is in terms of what I would put in a dictionary, but it's definitely more. I like it.

As for how it sounds, "fan fiction", to me, seems like someone attempting to translate the word for a mainstream audience. Which could be acafannish or could be noobish, but I wouldn't assume anything. I would think it looks wrong though.

Edited (Edited to actually, y'know, answer the question.) 2010-01-12 16:50 (UTC)

I have always used and seen used "fanfiction" (or "fanfic" as a short form); separating the words definitely makes it sound more clinical/academic/noob.

And I have to say that for myself, using "fan fiction" puts the emphasis in the wrong place. It's not "mystery fiction, mainstream fiction, fan fiction, science fiction..."; It's not just another classification of the standard understanding of fiction. Eliding the two words makes it clearer that it's not fiction "about the fan" or even "by the fan"--it's a whole different type of writing. (I'd say the division should be more on the order of "poetry, fiction, nonfiction, scripts, fanfiction, essays....)

I have always used Fanfiction as well - never Fan Fiction.

I like one-word fannish terms for use online because they're easier to do searches for, easier to use as tags, etc. I wonder if that has an effect on usage...

"Fan fiction" does not denote academia, particularly. The path that words take as the usage changes usually is: separate words, hyphenated compound, compound noun. The usage of this specific term is in transit, likely on it's way to becoming, ultimately, "fanfiction." Eventually the dictionaries will reach a consensus and all of them will reflect that usage. In the meantime . . . I guess you can flip a coin. :-)

I'ved used "fan fiction" my entire fannish life. Fandom at large seems to prefer "fanfiction" or, more commonly, "fanfic" (although that term also has been in use since the early days).

Just please don't use it as a plural. "I read some fanfictions today." No. Just . . . no. :-)

fanfictions ahhhh!

I think the only place I ever see that is fanficrants, which somewhat skews to fanfiction.net folks but not exclusively.

My personal opinion is that the fan fiction as aca signifier is in the mind of the reader, because there's over 5 million Google hits on fan fiction against over 9 million for fanfiction. Sure 9 is bigger than 5, but 5 million would be a lot of academics.

Ditto for the theory that it means outsider. One person's outsider is another person's fandom friend of 15 years.

The cool thing about Fanlore is that you can use either term and get to the same page when you click it.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

Opinions wanted!

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

Metafandomer

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject